Saturday, May 20, 2006

Joe Chat - Part 1

Posting messages on a newsgroup is a great way to share information, trade stuff, and in general, communicate with others in the online community. It's also fun to be able to have a real-time conversation with people who share your interests. In other words, a place to "chat". Chatrooms have been around for a long time, so it was only natural that the members of the Sandbox would also want one of their own.
"From: Keven T. Chapman
Date: Sat, Nov 23 1996

Greetings Joe Enthusiasts,

Just thought I would propose the idea of maybe establishing a GI Joe chat room somewhere. Unfortunately, I do not have the knowledge-base or experience to establish such a resource. I was wondering if there were any Joe enthusiasts which might be able to offer their expertise. I'm not sure what hoops one might have to jump through to establish such a resource, so I thought I would try to get some of the more WWW experienced folks involved.

It would be great if a GI Joe chat room could be established in which folks could drop in and out anytime to discuss GI Joe. What does everyone think? Anyone have any ideas, or suggestions?"
It was no more than a couple of days later that someone came up with a solution.
"From: Michael Cooper
Date: Sun, Nov 24 1996

Hey pals...

Some of you asked for this, so here it is.

Joe Chat is a WWW chat room for G.I. Joe enthusiasts (us.)

This is on my website, and free for all to use. You do need a JAVA-enabled browser (like Netscape.)

Try it out...LMK if it's worth keeping up.

http://home.earthlink.net/~mtcooper/joe_chat.htm [dead link]

Thanks,
Coop"
The feedback was positive:
"Check out the GI Joe chat room Michael has provided. Let's get some Joe talk going.
Keven T. Chapman"

"Why don't we set up a time to hold Presidential meetings. Or a time for the Joints Cheifs to get together. Maybe we can rap at the same time every week or something like that................................DUG"
"Sounds like a good idea to me. Right now I'm having trouble using the Old Sage's Chat.
THOR"
Of course, the first Sandbox chatroom wasn't without its share of bugs:
"From: Michael Cooper
Date: Mon, Dec 2 1996

1. Thanks to all who have tried out the chat room and provided me feedback on its operation.

1a. This is in Alpha testing, which means it aint perfect yet.

2. If you log into the chat room now you will get a message about a possible "Imposter Chat Room". There is no cause for concern. This is a result of an IP re-route at my ISP; Both EarthLink and ParaLogic have been notified, and are working to correct it. This message will in no way affect the operation of the chat room. The short version is: "don't worry about it."

3. It appears that Windows '95 is a requirement for the Joe Chat Room in addition to a "3.0" browser. If anyone has successfully logged on using a different operating system than WIN95 please LMK and I will stand corrected.

4. I propose a general get-acquainted Joe Chat on Wednesday, 04 December at 2100 EST (9 p.m. on the east coast - or 2 a.m Thursday in Greenwich...)

5. I know KTChapman and ProfessorX have sucessfully logged on, 'cause I talked to them both there. Has anyone else had a conversation on the chat room?

6. You do need to "connect" in order to see who else is logged on. If you just pull up the page on your browser, you could be missing a raging fight and never know it unless you connect.

8. In case you missed the URL:
http://home.earthlink.net/~mtcooper/joe_chat.htm [dead link]

9. When connecting, you only need to type in your username, the first line in the dialog box. Don't bother with real name, email address and password. These are for someday down the line when SSA secure capabilities are added for commerce purposes.

10. I want to publically thank [Maria Lee Bisonnette] for putting a link to the chat room on her excellent Joe page. Salute!

11. POC this memo is the undersigned.

Coop"
Initially a shedule was proposed for every Wednesday at 2100 EST. This seemed to work for a while. By August of 97 though, "Coop's Chat", as it came to be known, had evolved into an everyday habit for some.
"From: Greg Brown
Date: Wed, Aug 13 1997

Hey everyone, if you are wanting to talk Joe on Coop's Chat Room, four of my buds and I have been meeting at 9ish p.m., central standard time. Drop in and let's talk Joe. Over and out...

Greg"
"From: Robert Sorrels
Date: Thurs, Aug 14 1997

What day?
Rob"
"From: Greg Brown
Date: Fri, Aug 15 1997

Every evening at 9 cst. Hope to see you there. Bigger crowd tonight (lost count). Lots o Joe-heads.

Over and out..

Greg"
Another Sandboxer, Leo Sutedja, organized the first ever Sandbox Halloween figure contest that year. Coop's Chat became an important part of those proceedings:
"From: Leo Sutedja
Date: Fri, Oct 17 1997

...Dave, are you gonna make one for Halloween ? I've heard from 10 people so far, some will even make more than one halloween Joe :) All of the entries will be unveiled midnite 31st oct, and meet up at Coop's Joe Chat then ..

-Leo Sutedja"
For a long time, Coop's Chat was the place for deals and trades to be made, for fellow Joe collectors to shoot the breeze, and in some instances for general mayhem to occur.
"From: Rob Marshall
Date: Mon, Nov 3 1997

Just a quick note to say that I lurked for a while in Coop's chat room and found it to be fun, entertaining and really friendly.

Great idea Coop.

Rob"
A few months later, a change of server was announced:
"From: Michael Cooper
Date: Thurs, May 7 1998

Joe Chat has moved, as have I.

http://www.c2i2.com/~mcooper/joe_chat.htm [dead link]

Still fun, still free, still open to all.

//Coop"
Everyone followed the move to the new url. There were also some new folks joining the fun. Here is a sample "thumbs up" from one of the newbies of the time:
"From: Ken Davis
Date: Sat, Sep 26 1998

Last night, Friday Sept 25 I checked out the on-line "party" at Coop's Chat for the first time. Wow-- what alot of fun. All the famous and favourites from the Sandbox were there- countless conversations going on all at the same time--wild. If any of you haven't tried this out, DO so. These folks are swell people."
"From: Griffworks
Date: Sat, Sep 26 1998

And Ken was very entertaining as well! A good time was had, and several trade deals were accomplished, too! If you've not been the URL is: http://www.c2i2.com/%7Emcooper/joe_chat.htm [dead link]

I won't be there tonight, myself. However, go on by and have a great time! Party usually starts about 9pm EDT.

Jeffrey Griffin ITFC #0024"
Things continued to go well for several more months. Then at the beginning of the following year something happened to Coops.
"From: KevHead
Date: Fri, Jan 8 1999

ALLIED FORCES FULL ALERT!!!

ALERT!! ALERT!!! ALERT!!!!

Coops Joe Chat is down!!!
Says not found on this server!!

Thor and the A**es sorry, Axis forces have done something!!!

Coops Chat is Gone, all hope is lost, lost I tell you......."
"From: GREG BUCK
Date: Fri, Jan 8 1999

It's true,

Coop's Chat cannot be found ("URL not found on this server").

I hope this is some kind of internet burp.

Heck, I just re-designed my tin-foil helmet and got my "battle-armor" from the cleaners.

I'll be lighting a circle of candles around my computer and bowing to the cyber-gods as I attempt (and re-attempt) entry into Coop's Chat.

CHK6...See Ya!

Torch
(donning tin-foil Chat helmet now)"
It was true. No-one really knew why, but tin-foil helmets not withstanding, Coop's Chat was gone. Nevertheless, Sandboxers are a resourceful bunch and it wasn't long before other chat solutions were offered. In the next article, we'll see the various places Sandbox chat went to and where it finally found a home.

For the curious and nostalgic here is a link to an archived copy of Coop's Chat:
Coop's Chat @ Archive.org

(Caution: Watch out for pop-ups on the above link)

Monday, May 01, 2006

Mike Leon and the Venture Toys Scandal

For collectors who were accustomed to paying 50 to 100 dollars for custom uniform sets from the likes of Cotswold, Circle Home Studios, and Tripwire Toys, 1998 was a year of great promise. The grotesque poorly articulated bodies of the 12" Hall of Fame figures made way for an all new GI Joe body design with much better articulation in the Classic Collection series figures. 21st Century Toys was a new kid on the block with Viet Nam era military uniform sets selling for around $15 each and with rumors of their own figure as well. Then there was the announcement that yet another outfit was getting ready to produce and sell an entire line of highly detailed police and military uniform sets for similarly low prices.

Unfortunately, what started out as a dream come true turned out to be nothing more than a pipe dream, and even a nightmare for some. Here is one of the more infamous of the Sandbox scandals.

It began with the following Sandbox post from February of 1998 with what was incredible news!:
"From: Mike Leon
Date: Tues, Feb 3 1998

As you know I was at the NorCal show,.... I'll stick by my observations about Tripwire, he wasn't selling very much, how could he with 21st toys rep (Rex Adams) across the hallway selling box after box of gear at full retail ($16.95). It's not hard to figure out that people are going to spend $16.95 for 21st Tiger strip uniform complete with gear vs a $75.00 Tiger strip uniform from Tripwire. Besides a good clue about how he's really doing could clearly be seeing by the size of his display. All the big customizers always rented a room to themselves, this year was no exception. Auggie had is own so did Major midnite, Mike Stannard but this time Tripwire was sharing a room, did you notice, all he had was just one small table.

Which goes back to what I was talking about, Tripwire having to go in other directions in order to survive (police and firefighters). As you saw the pictures I posted from the show, he seems to be going in that direction. But I think he may have some troubles here, there's another big company on the horizon that wants to enter the 12 action figure market. This company already has a very successful line of non military action figures. They want to start making accessory packs similar to 21st toys but dealing with non military services and accessories. I was asked to head up the marketing of this project. They flew me up to Seattle last week for several days of discussions. I came back on Saturday to think about it. After calling Merk and a few others friends from this NG to discuss this project, and with a high urging from Merk I called them today to accept their offer, so I faxed in my contract.
Stay tuned.

Scouts out!
Mike"
So, who was this Mike Leon? In his own words:
"From: Mike Leon
Date: Wed, Oct 1 1997

Hi all, i'm still here, I just got back from Florida where I was over seeing the final work to my dream house. I was also down there to be interviewed for an upcoming article in a vintage military aircraft magazine, about the restoration of "Stonewall" my Bell UH-1B (huey) and how this particular vintage firebird was used in Nam. I'll let you all know when it comes out.

Also, at the same time I got interviewed for an upcoming article for Home Office Computing magazine about how I use my digital camera for my business and paintball in general. All in all i've been very busy this month with travel. I've been to L.A. to visit Mike Maceda and went to the Desimone show (I have pictures of his tank), from there I went back East, came back this weekend for the Bay Area Joe show in Santa Clara, and i'm getting ready to go off to the Philly show this Thursday.

Here is my completed house taken as i’m flying towards it, located outside Coral Springs Florida. The right side of the house is set up as my hobby room (Joe room) and the left side is the 4 car garage and above that the 4 bedrooms are located. The center dome is the kitchen and behind is located the living and family rooms. Oh yeah, the back wide white patio area with the cross, is where the i’ll park “Stonewall”.

Scouts Out!
Mike
Venture Games Paintball Park"
Some more background information:
"Date: Wed, Feb 25 1998

...for those that are new to this NG and don't know me too well (I travel a lot). My name is Mike Leon, I'm 40 years old and I'm semi-retired. I sold most of my businesses last year, but have my hand in several promising ventures which keeps me traveling, this is why I get to go to a lot of Joe events, and in turn you (the NG) get to see the latest (pictures) from those events."
One of his businesses happened to be the paintball park named above called Venture Games. It was only natural that the new toy company would be called Venture Toys.

It seems Mike had a fairly good reputation in the Sandbox as evidenced by these posts:
"From: rebonitz
Date: Sun, Mar 2 1997

I had the pleasure of playing on Mike Leon's Paintball field (Venture Games) with four of my buddies this past Saturday, and I have to say a good time was had by all. This was my first time meeting Mike and I must
say he is a good man.

Thank you Mike for your hospitality, you have a great field and worth visiting again. We even did a little Joe trading afterwards. We definitley got our exercise charging up and down those hills. Nothing like a little running to remind me that I'm almost 36 and can't quite do the things I did when I was a young Jarhead. Man, it sucks getting old!

Thanks again Mike. "

"From: Colin Epstein
Date: Tues, Feb 24 1998

He's picked up ME [Masterpiece Edition] Joes for me, and delivered them personally, despite my living at least an hour away from him. He showed a troop of my co-workers a great time at his paintball park without letting me pay for a thing while I was there. He's helped other Sandboxers in similar ways."

"From: JRT82281
Date: Wed, Feb 25 1998

When I first came to the Sandbox, I first thought Mike Leon was a nasty brute who showed off his knowledge and accepted no other opinions but his. Yes, his replys sometimes maybe a little heated, but this guy is one good joe who will help you at any time with anything. If you respond negatively to him, he'll do the same. It's a fair response. Since then, I've gotten to appreciate his influence. I have talked to him many times asking him advice on WWII German uniforms and I have gotten the greatest and most helpful responses. He has done a lot for the Sandbox and should be regarded as the military reference historian for the box. He is a good man and if you trash him, the whole sandbox will come crashing down on that person, guaranteed."

"From: DUG
Date: Tues, Feb 24 1998

I know Mike and he's a [darn] good Joe."
The 6th Annual Bay Area GI Joe convention was held in San Jose, CA in May of that year. Mike set up a booth for Venture Toys. The response was very positive and things were looking very good! Take a look at this enthusiastic review:
"From: Nick Corea
Date: Sun, May 31 1998

Hi ladies and gentlemen,

I was just at the Joe Show at the Airport Inn in San Jose.

Next to the 21st Century table, were some of the most detailed, highest quality gear I've ever seen in miniature.

I've been building/painting/modifying models for many years (I'm 30) and I have friends that work in the effects and model industry in the LA area, and I've seen some incredible work in small scale.

The Venture Toy's gear was VERY impressive!!! Great designs, nice (scale) hardware, durable/scale fabrics, hi quality stitch-work, realism with no compromises that I could see, these pieces look like one-of-a-kind custom pieces that should cost near $100/ set.

To be honest, I thought (at first glance) that this stuff was the next generation of 21st Century gear. To most of us, 21st C. has set new standards for quality and realism in toy accessories. (They blow away the quality of commercial 1/6th accessories seen previously.)

But, to be honest, the Venture Toy's gear blows 21st away with realism, detail and cool factor. Where 21st has solid cast pouches, Venture has tiny, velcro-assisted, very scale, working pouches.(reminiscent of Kankichi Ryotsu's SWAT outfit, but with more, smaller and more detailed parts) Their riot shield and baton are terrific. Helical (phone-cord) com wires are so scale, they hang and act perfectly. I'm not kidding, it has to be seen to be understood. The websight pictures are cool, and tell what they have (they had more at the show, than what they have on the websight), but trust me, my friend and I were huddled over the table with our mouths hanging open!!!

Don't get me wrong, I still LOVE 21st Gear. Venture will just expand my collection, and will look great next to 21st. Venture isn't competing directly, with the same outfits and scenarios.

I didn't see much in the way of weapons, I hope Venture Toys Inc spends as much time detailing weapons (different ones), at least as nice as 21st. then everything will be perfect!!!

Thanx for hearing me out, (whew)

Nick Corea"
Mike also set up a booth at the International G.I. Joe Convention in San Antonio held at the end of July. Here are a number of posts about his booth and prototype samples.
"From: Steve Costa
Date: Mon, Jun 29 1998

I received an e-mail from Mike Leon regarding the Law Enforcement Series being produced by Venture Toys. Apparently, there will be a big roll out at the San Antonio Convention. First up is going to be an LAPD Patrol Officer in standard service uniform followed by New York PD and Chicago PD Patrol Officers in their standard service uniforms with gear. In addition, there are going to be a number of State Troopers, amongst them the CHP. SWAT uniforms and gear will be available with a number of different uniform patches to semi-customize your figure. I can't wait to see these!

Steve Costa"

"From: Steven Charlton
Date: Mon, Aug 3 1998

Venture was there, and if the stuff makes it to the store looking anything like his prototypes, I think a lot of kids are going to have a ball playing Cops & Robbers with GI Joe. Mike just needs to come up with some carded perp sets."

"From: Robert W. Brown
Date: Mon, Aug 3 1998

Venture Toys is the one to watch next year. Their gear puts the other law enforcement/anti-terrorist stuff to shame. And with gear/uniform/weapon sets in the $12-$20 range, I could outfit an entire Joe police department with this stuff!"
Here are some photos of the booth on Jim (Jimbob Wan) Stelling's website: http://users2.ev1.net/~jimbobwan/tripod/gijsa13.htm

It was about this time that the new outfit launched a website. At least a few Sandboxers, Ken Clow, Robert DeCastro, and Steve Costa were providing both material and talent assistance to Venture Toys. Here is an example:
"From: Steven A. Costa
Date: Thurs, Jul 30 1998

Venture Toys will also be releasing TONS of GOOD STUFF in the law enforcement field. LAPD, NYPD, and Chicago PD regular patrol officers in addition to various State Troopers including the CHP. A whole line of SWAT and anti-terrorist gear will be available as well. Check out http://www.venturetoys.com. [dead link]

Steve Costa"

"From: Venture Toys
Date: Thurs, Jul 30 1998

Good evening Steve,

Thanks for the kind words and support. Thank you for sending us your department patch. It will be added to our long list of Department patches avilable for salse through our website. Just think about it, people around the world will know that their is a Contra costa County Sheriff dept. out their.

On a side note, you might notice some pictures from San Antonio showing our APC. If you get a good look it say C.C.C. Sheriff SWAT. Again, thanks for the technical support.

Venture Toys"

"From: Ken Clow
Date: Wed, Aug 12 1998

A new GI Joe Club is forming in the Southern California area. Namely in Ventura. I will be there to show off some of the new Venture Toys stuff, plus also give out some customizing tips on 21st's Utimate Soldier sets."
There was a lot of anticipation brewing in the Sandbox, looking forward to the 1999 debut of Venture Toys' products. Unfortunately, just a few months later, the Venture Toys website disappeared and signs of trouble started hitting the 'Box.
"From: Robert Decastro
Date: Wed, Oct 21 1998

What I'm about to ask may alarm some of you guys but here goes.

I've been out of contact with Mike Leon for about over a month. I mean zero contact and I'm concerned. If any of you guys out there have been contacted or if you have spoken to him recently please let me know.

Thanks,
Robert

P.S. If you guys are wondering why the Venture toys site is no longer up don't ask me, I'm wondering myself."

"From: Robert Decastro
Date: Wed, Oct 21 1998

Greg Claytor wrote:

> Hey Robert,
> I thought I saw some blurb on "Plastic Crash Island" about Venture
> toys. I didn't get the impression the plug had been pulled at all. To
> ad to the mystery though, Mike used to stop in from time to time
> following his exit in order to update us on his "Venture". I haven't
> seen one of those updates in what seems like forever.
> Hopefully he's just traveling, busy and cutting deals. Hope he gives us
> an update again sometime before Y2K.
> Greg--

If that was the case then I would know about it. I'm the guy
making the stuff for him and there is no move that Mike makes
without me knowing it. Atleast until now. "

"From: Ken Clow
Date: Wed, Oct 21 1998

I too have not heard from Mike Leon. I have been trying to get a hold of him since San Antonio. I checked the Venture Toys web sight and it no longer exists. He has a number of my things related to my Joes. Over $2000 dollars worth. I AM EXTREMELY CONCERNED ABOUT GETTING MY STUFF BACK!! I am even considering a reward. Can any of you help me?

Ken.. "
Another Sandboxer then posted this bit of bad news in reply:
"From: MERK
Date: Wed, Oct 21 1998

I was talking to Mike about a month ago. He told me that he WAS pullin` the plug on Venture Toys. No rumour...fact. I`m REALLY suprised that neither you, Ken nor Rob D. knows about this, but I`m sure Mike will contact you. I`m sure Mike is just caught up in some personal stuff right now.

MERK!!..................Deeds Speak!! "

"From: Robert Decastro
Date: Wed, Oct 21 1998

No Merk I did not know that Mike will shut down Venture

But with the things Ken and I just recently discovered I'm not surprised. I believe that If you hadn't said it here I would never have known that this was his intentions :(

I'm a very large part of ventures (40%) and "I" didn't know that Ventures is closing down.

I'm as confused as all of you at this moment.

Robert"
Some Sandboxers were still willing to give Mike the benefit of the doubt, attributing the missing website to server problems, or the lack of communication to travel, business, or hurricane (George was a severe one at the time.) Ken Clow followed up with this post:
"From: Ken Clow
Date: Fri, Oct 23 1998

Been there, done all of that and more. I contacted the Police on Tuesday of this week and had them do a 'Check the welfare call' at his residence. No one answered. They left a message on his door for Mike to call me. Wednesday of this week I had a friend drive to his residence to see if he could reach Mike. There was no answer at the door and no note left by the Police. He stayed at his residence for 3 hours but no sign of Mike and his family.

I contacted the person who takes care of Mike's websight on Tuesday. He is some-kinda paranoid kid who is on the look out for Black Helicopters and MiBs. And by Wednesday, VTs web sight was down. For those who would like to contact him his name is David P. ... Today was last day we were going to give Mike to contact us. My next step is to talk to Robert and discuss what are next steps will be.

**NOTE TO MIKE, DO YOU REALLY WANT THIS TO CONTINUE? IT'LL ALL STOP IF YOU CONTACT US IMMEDIATELY.**"

That same day, Robert posted a message with the subject line, "My last words about Mr.Leon and Venture Toys":
"From: Robert Decastro
Date: Fri, Oct 23 1998

It's unfortunate that what I'd hope to be a great product line was just just that. hope and an empty one at that.

I'm not going into all the details of all the thing that I've uncovered about my illustrious partner just that I'm deeply shocked and dissapointed.

But for you guys out there that got all excited about the failed V.T. line, I leave you with these final thoughts and my last words about M.Leon and V. Toys........

I may be down but I'm not out........and in the words of Arnold Schwarzenegger..............................

'I'LL BE BACK'"

Those may have been his last words, but every story has its "final chapter." That was the title of the thread started a few days later.
"From: Robert Decastro
Date: Tues, Oct 27 1998

Tuesday October 27/98 12:19 pm

A Fedex delivery man handed me a mediun sized box containing nearly all of the property owed to me by Mike L.

I still haven't heard from Ken C. but as for me I'm satisfied. I'm also glad that this whole mess didn't get any uglier than it had to be. Now I will just go on with my life and hopfully make a comeback in the industry. Despite all that has transpired I would like to wish Mike, good life. I thank him for doing the right thing. And to the Sandbox, I'm sorry you guys had to see the skeletons in our closets. To all the Sandboxers who was there for me, a big THANK YOU!!!! I won't forget you guys.

So now for me, I close this chapter of my life.

NOW LETS GET BACK TO JOE :) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Ken also brought closure to his end of the story in the same thread:
"From: Ken Clow
Date: Thurs, Oct 29 1998

Dear friends,
I received a call earily yesterday morning from Robert telling me he got most of his stuff back from Mike Leon. With this in mind, I waited around till noon for Victor the FedEx guy to arrive. Noon came and went with no delivery from Victor. By about 1:00 the chest pains came back so did the neck pain and the headache. Giving up hope, I went on about my day.

Around 4:00 a glint of white, purple and orange flashed in front of my eyes. Out popped Victor in his gleaming, freshly waxed FedEx truck. "Got one for ya Ken." I swore I saw a glimmer come off his teeth. He handed me the package, I think I signed with an 'X'. Well I got MOST of my equipment back. HE KEPT MY LARGE BLACK UTILITY
POUCH that I paid about $30.00 DOLLARS FOR. I guess I am happy but, getting to this point has been very stressful to me. I found myself barking at my wife and my 2 year old daughter for stupid reasons for which I am truely sorry. I love them both very much. I also owe you-all in the Sand here an apology for bringing my personal
problems to you. I love you all very much.

I learned a lot about Mike in my quest to get my stuff back. None of it good. I don't ever want to see this man again. Frankly, I think it was only your help that we got MOST of our stuff back. (Robert did not get
two of his Vests back.)

I did so want Venture Toys to work out. I feel sorry not only for you folks but sorry for the people at Safariland and Blackhawk. They were very helpful in loaning us Law Enforcement and Military equipment for
Robert to copy. Again my apoligies to them.

The future looks bright though! I know Robert has been talking with 21st Century and hopefully something great will come out of it.

If you are in Los Angeles this weekend come to the Great Western Gun Militaria Show at the Pomona Fair Grounds. 21st will have a booth in building 7. Come see them if you can.

Again my sincerist apologies and many thanks,

Kenneth Robert Clow.

P.S. Anybody got some Tumms?"


Where are they now?

After a long hiatus, Robert has recently returned to posting in the 'Box. His custom work is still astounding and the envy of many a Sandboxer.

Ken Clow continued to post in the Sandbox up until about the summer of 2003. His current whereabouts are unknown.

Mike Leon still operates his paintball park outside of Oakland, California.